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Shelving

In the closet behind the Flat Screen TV Install we built a couple of wide shelves out of a Bi-Fold Door. We needed to shelve the rest of the space. Because of the width of the space(41”) and the depth of the shelves (15”) we made them out of 3/4” plywood.

The client decided how much space she needed between the various shelves which determined the spacing. In small sizes plywood is a sound shelf. In larger sizes you need to stiffen it for use.

Having determined our locations, the first order was to install wall cleats to support the back and sides of our shelves.
cleats1
These were made with 1×2 pine screwed to the studs with 2- 2” deck screws at each stud location. The right side pictured here has the cleat extending beyond the face of the shelf due to the location of the stud. Not elegant but sturdy.

Here is our closet with the cleats installed.  You can also see the outlet mounted for the TV toys, Dish receiver, DVD/VCR Player, surround sound, etc. Also are the holes for passing the cables between the boxes and the TV. I offset the holes between the front and back to that light was not an issue. Yes I know it is a picky detail.

cleats2

Shelf Edge Detail

The fronts of the ply shelves are  reinforced with an aluminum channel. Here is a photo showing the edge detail at the front of the shelves. This is an aluminum channel cut to length and glued and screwed to the front edge of the shelf. I used a countersink bit to drill the holes to keep the top of the screw below the face of the channel.  We also sanded the channel and sprayed it with KILZ primer sealer as a base coat for the finish paint. Latex paints do not stick to metal very well.  We are using Shelving and BEHR Premium Plus Ultra   Semi Gloss in White.

edgedetail

Speaking of BEHR

We bought a can of BEHR Premium Plus Ultra to try out. I will not recommend or use it again. The theory is that having the primer and paint will save time and or steps. It doesn’t.  The cost of materials is basically the same within a buck, and your savings come from having to cover the area once.  It did not seal and cover the mill stamp(the black printing that is stamped on all lumber telling you where it was produced) and the two areas we used it in had an uneven finish. Part gloss part flat. We ended up second coating it. No net savings labor wise.

It is still better to use primer and paint as separate operations. Priming coats and seals your wall surfaces, as well as pointing out defects that get covered by sanding so you can fix them before putting down you final color.

I am still a Fanboy of BEHR Paint, just not the primer/sealer paint.

Here is our closet with the shelves installed and painted.

cleats3

10 comments to Shelving and BEHR Premium Plus Ultra report

  • Although it’s unfortunate that you did not find the product to your liking, we appreciate your honest and detailed account of your experience.

    There are a number of things that likely affected the performance of the product. First, we recognize and try to make clear with our Premium Plus Ultra product that there are many projects that require additional coats. In this case, due to the surface porosity of the wood, multiple coats may be needed for an even sheen. The convenience is buying only one product. In many cases, it will save you coats and time, but that all depends on the intended application and surface. As for the stamp, it needs to be sanded or removed; otherwise, it requires a specialty Primer & Sealer for best performance.

    We appreciate all of the great expert insight you have to share, as it helps influence future product updates and decisions. Please feel free to rate and review our products on our new Web site (BehrPro.com).

    Thanks for your continued support of Behr!

  • Behr Pro,
    Thx for stopping by.
    As you may have discovered I am an extreme fanboy of Behr Paint. My fault with the primer/paint was the coverage on the previously painted surfaces. It was uneven. I was using the semi-gloss. Like I mentioned partially flat and partially glossy. (yes I did mix it up before application)

    On this project there were a number of different areas that made this a particularly good test bed for this product.
    I had raw drywall, raw plywood, metal edging, and previously painted surfaces.

    The application was made with a 6” semi gloss roller cover(Whizz Roller System 6″ Multi-Purpose Roller Cover) and was painted evenly. It was put on liberally, as this is not my first time with a paint can.

    I needed two coats on the raw drywall surfaces, which I frankly did not expect, due to the advertising of the product. Normally I use sealer primer and then the finish color.

    Same two coats, but Behr Paint usually covers in one coat. Even when I am painting dark over light or vice versa. Which is why I use and recommend it. I am as lazy as the next person. The one time I did have a problem was on a textured wall using a dark red to cover a butter yellow.

    The shelving was ACX that was sanded prior to painting.
    http://www.lemurzone.com/rfg/index.php/2008/06/04/fun-with-plywood-2/
    As expected the first coat did raise the grain, but with light sanding, the paint flowed smoothly and covered well. The sheen issue was there, but was not the issue that the finish wall around the TV was.

    The one pre treatment step I did take was sanding and using KILZ brand primer sealer on the aluminum channel used as a stiffner on the front edge of the plywood shelves.
    This was done to promote adhesion and to round the edges of the channel to minimise paint chipping with shelving use.

    As for the grade stamp on the lumber, you folks should come up with an ink that you can sell them that would mark yet get covered by your product. You are right in as much as you need almost a solvent based primer to stop the bleeding. They must use the same ink that magic markers use.

    At the end of the day the biggest issue was the sheen on the semi gloss even over previously painted surfaces, still needing the same number of coats. Flats probably work great.

    The price differential which here amounted to about a dollar(can of primer/paint vs can of primer and can of finish paint)

    Saving me a a tool cleaning by needing only 1 roller between coats, or the cost of a disposable cover is just not worth the ‘if’ factor, as in do i need another coat?, to this remodeler is not worth it, especially when doing this for clients.

  • Head Lemur,

    The Premium Plus Ultra is a unique two-in-one paint and primer, but definitely NOT a one-coat solution. Our technical data sheet for this product details all the various applications and preparation that require additional coats, or in some cases, a specialty product. For instance, the sheen issue you’re having is most likely related to the surface porosity. For uneven surfaces, you need an additional coat to make sure it is sealed correctly. And as you know, certain colors, like red and yellow are tough to cover, often requiring more than one coat.

    Thanks for the additional insight (and recommendation). We appreciate your business and support of our brand. We value the feedback from our customers, especially someone like yourself who brings a lot of experience with our products. I’ll definitely pass this information on to our product development team.

  • It’s always comforting to have the manufacturer take the time to respond to these types of articles with a well-thought-out and useful response. Behr gets big kudos!

    Kim and I used to be big fans of Behr interior latex paints. About three years ago we switched to Ralph Lauren at the suggestion of a friend. We had an excellent experience painting our dining room – almost full coverage of a dark brown in only 1 coat. While RL is about $9 / gallon more, we’ve never hesitated to pay the premium. I am confident that you actually use 50% of the paint that would be required with Behr or most other brands.

    Just my $0.02.

  • Joanna

    OK, so Behr paints suck.
    I am an architectural details specialist and deal with painted surfaces on the daily basis.

    The Behr’s primer is the worst garbage available on the market – it covers nothing, just smudges.
    As opposed to say Sherwin Williams primer which takes ONE COAT to cover black felt marks left by obnoxious tenant’s children, or aforementioned lumber stamps, and dries to a velvety, smooth surface.
    Behr’s ceiling paint is another disaster product – one of these “penny-wise pound-foolish” items:
    It might be cheaper per gallon but since you have to give every ceiling AT LEAST two coats, not only your total paint costs is ultimately higher but what about the DOUBLE (or even triple) LABOR?
    Compare to any other decent brands (Sherwin, Moore) where we had to only use ONE COAT for the ceiling, one coat for the walls for light colors and double for deep base.
    Same with eggshell paints – Behr is more coats and more labor. Behr’s dark colors have been known to take up to 5 coats to cover evenly.

    Alas, there is ONE SOLE EXCEPTION – Behr premium plus METALLIC PAINT. Lousy selection of colors, but boy does it cover!
    We are using various expensive metallic paints for faux finishes, including the much-hyped Modern Masters, and the quality of coverage we get from Behr simply rocks.

    Too bad they only have silver, copper and plain gold…which forces us to use the other brands…

    I did notice the Behr keeps answering people’s posts here, so perhaps my comments won’t be allowed here if this is Behr-controlled website.
    I tried.

  • Joanna,
    There are no outside influences here. I was surprised to have BEHR folks stop by. Everything I note or report on I purchase and use. NO coupons, freebies or endorsements.

    Your experiences are interesting, and are different than mine. In most cases I figure coverage at 50-75% of what the can says depending on color difference.

    I agree with you on ‘ceiling’ paint, of any brand. I suspect that there may be less solids in them and having 8+ foot ceilings hides poor coverage.

    I recently did a popcorn ceiling;
    http://www.lemurzone.com/rfg/index.php/2009/08/23/painting-popcorn-ceilings/, where I used the flat product.

    I have a couple of questions regarding application.
    Are your people spraying it?
    It is a thick bodied paint and I don’t see successful application by thinning it to get it through a gun. Coverage goes right out the window:)
    I get good coverage because I roll it using at least a 3/8” nap roller for smooth walls and going bigger depending on depth and type of textured walls here in the Southwest.(don’t get me started on textured walls)

    Are the painters rolling dry looking for coverage?
    Rolling dry means rolling until you can hear the sound of frying bacon from your roller. This is extremely bad as you get a thinner coat of paint which will surely bleed through, and by running your roller dry will make it harder to pick up a full load of paint, which is a recipe for more labor and less coverage.

    The one thing that I have discovered in the Southwest is you need to paint fast, as the humidity is so low that the paints skin over and will flash if you dawdle.

  • Torrance

    Thanks for the info about rolling dry. I didn’t know it was a Bad Thing.

  • Denis

    Used this paint remodeling our bathroom, because we had a few layers of wall paper and we wanted an unstipeled ceiling we redrywalled the entire room. We useed BEHR Ultra Primer/Paint it took two coats and I fully expected this. what I didn’t expect was that all the paint would peel off. After a three week drying period my wife deceided she would like to have a white ceiling, so I taped off a boarder and while adjusting the tape I notice that the paint was pulling off of the ceiling in little blisters. Oh great i thought and pulled the full lenght down about a third of the paint under the tape lifted. Very thin peel of latex. it had not stuck to the plaster at all. I followed the instructions on the can as to washing etc. and the tape was the green painters tape. it had been on the wall for about three minutes. I would not recommend this paint as an all in one, ever!
    All i se is many hour’s of trying to clean up the mess. If anyone has any recommendations of how to get the paint of the wall without gouging the heck out of everything I would love your advice!

  • Denis —
    Our bath is currently still in the middle of a remodel. (Yeah. A postage stamp-sized bath probably shouldn’t take more than a year to redo, but hey, don’t judge.) When I painted the beadboard last year, the mother came up with an ingenious solution: use the outside paint! (Flat white – special color mix for us – of the paint and primer in one.) Her theory was that if it can withstand all the rain, extreme temps, sunlight, etc. (which ours generally handles for a few seasons) then it should be able to handle the extreme climate changes that bathrooms endure.

    That was nearly 15 months ago. I still have some painting to do (trim, gingerbread, cabinetry) but the surfaces I did paint still look brand new.

  • To each their own. My entire house is painted with BEHR and I am absolutely happy! I have used both a coat of primer and then a coat of paint on my kitchen cabinets…they did not hold up well. One motivated day I decided to re-do them in a lighter color..white actually. I invested in the paint/primer combo and it only took 1 coat. They are beautiful! No peeling. It even went over sharpie (the creation of one of my children!) and the sharpie did not bleed through. Needless to say, I have no desire to change product brand. BEHR has great color choices and quality result at a price we can afford.